So why do people seem to think that 3 hours of live music is not worth the price of a pint?

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Permalink Reply by Kirsty Pollock on November 28, 2010 at 20:47

Nice try on the beer!!!

I have been thinking if we could do some sort of deal with the pub/venue of the sort 'Brains' suggests - in which case yeah, the ticket price would have to exceed beer price (which can get a bit hairy round these 'ere parts!). I'm sure we'll have plenty of opportunities to try.

There's a pub (I forget which, Steven was telling me) that wants bands - but doesn't pay at all. I am not sure quite who they will get on that basis - you can go to a jam night and not get paid - but not have to cart yer gear....

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Permalink Reply by Mike Howell on December 3, 2010 at 11:01

Trouble with that Kirsty is other threads on here attacking that very concept as Pay to Play. My feeling is that you have to establish the night with the venue and other bands as a music night with a door charge - once you have done that the people coming are the music fans who will pay £3 for a night of music, the casual "let's pop in here for a couple" or even the regulars will start to avoid that night. Also, sensible landlords will know the 5/6 regulars who are ther EVERY night and probably let them stay uncharged. Long term, if you pick a midweek night to do it, then both the bands and the landlord will benefit.

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Permalink Reply by Kirsty Pollock on December 3, 2010 at 11:19

Trouble with that Kirsty is other threads on here attacking that very concept as Pay to Play.

not sure whether you mean jam nights or pubs that want bands but don't pay. I wasn't coming out in favour (or against) either. I was just wondering what on earth would motivate a band to bring and set up all their gear and play a full gig - especially when they could do a few numbers at a jam night, have a laugh and only have to bring the instrument itself (if that - one local jam even has a selection of guitars and a bass).

Or if you meant "ticket includes free beer" I am not sure how that's "Pay to Play" - suppose you could see it that way if you have to cover a venue hire. I see that situation more as being an independent promoter in partnership with the venue.

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Permalink Reply by Mike Howell on December 3, 2010 at 11:46

Kirsty Pollock said:

Trouble with that Kirsty is other threads on here attacking that very concept as Pay to Play.

not sure whether you mean jam nights or pubs that want bands but don't pay. I wasn't coming out in favour (or against) either. I was just wondering what on earth would motivate a band to bring and set up all their gear and play a full gig - especially when they could do a few numbers at a jam night, have a laugh and only have to bring the instrument itself (if that - one local jam even has a selection of guitars and a bass).

Or if you meant "ticket includes free beer" I am not sure how that's "Pay to Play" - suppose you could see it that way if you have to cover a venue hire. I see that situation more as being an independent promoter in partnership with the venue.

I was refering to the situation in pubs like the Wooden Bridge, which I see you commented on - fine if you want to take the risk, but as others have said, once you have equipped and rehearsed a band, do you really then want to be paying out for beer vouchers to sell on to your mates? Personally I think this is the thin end of the wedge and something bands should avoid.

I do have sympathy for landlords, especially those tied into punative leaseholds but I really don't see how, if they want to be a music pub, they can justify not paying for music.

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Permalink Reply by Hiram K Hackenbacker on December 6, 2010 at 8:53

I was thinking about what makes me want to go to see a band play live and it seems to me that what's needed is some kind of entertainment value beyond playing a few songs, a kind of novelty factor. If you are a covers band then the chosen set list could have a couple of tunes that involve audience participation, the punters love to sing along. Many covers bands play very similar sets so try to pick some songs that aren't run of the mill just because they are easy or self gratifying. Also if you have a couple of catchy originals to throw in or can rework a song into a different style then that also shows a bit of individuality.

To me, another important factor is the visual aspect. So many bands get up on stage and just stand there playing and singing as if they were rehearsing. Putting on a good show is more than just playing well, and a bit of a stage act (by all band members, not just the singer) and maybe a gimmick or two can go a long way to making a potential punter choose you over another band. Well that's what this particular punter thinks anyway.

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Permalink Reply by Kirsty Pollock on December 6, 2010 at 10:10

Hmm, very good point, and true for most I think. We'd LOVE the audience to sing along, and we have a coupla numbers pretty suitable .... but it seems to need a certain audience density to get them started, not enough people, and people are too shy. I have seen many singers look like complete divs asking for singalong and then nobody bothers.

I do try to "dress up", and the boys do bop along a bit and try for a few moves - I thik it can be overdone and personally I really hate obvious "stagey" stuff - genuine exuberance wins for me every time, even if the moves themselves are not perfecty timed or executed.

The Greedies can and do try to vary the set form the 'norm' - but it seems that over the last few years local bands have converged on the a lot of the same 'not quite the norm' songs! Or maybe they were less out of the ordinary than we thought! There is also the dilemma that if you play stuff the audience doesn't know, then they aren't as keen (though if it's in style and well done they can be won over). So yeah, lots of folks play "the favourites". I don't think ease of playing has really been a huge factor in picking our set - at least not in recent months, and we have been gradually dropping some of the "fillers". We are certainly technically competent to do more complex stuff - depends on what we like mainly. I think that's the way to go -play stuff you love and that shines through to the audience....

Maybe we should start doing God Save the Queen and I can dig out that sequinned bikini and tiara again.....

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Permalink Reply by dave on January 28, 2011 at 0:04

turfing out the non payers was a bad move, you need to win those people over and turn them around so they want to pay and support the band get them to the gigs where theres no door money , get every member of the band doing the walk around in the breaks meet as many punters as you can and connect with them ,you have to become thier band .the them and us attitude that a lot of bands have is fine for a wedding or function band but the local weekend warriors have to be considered  part of the local tribe.if your not gigging go to see other local bands you must get to meet as many  punters as poss as often as poss.building a good supporting crowd is the hardest and most important thing to acheive, but it must be done.i dont think the few non payers were being nasty ,its more likely they were a bit taken back by being asked for money after already getting in.i dont think it matters if you charge £3 or the full £5

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Permalink Reply by Kirsty Pollock on January 28, 2011 at 9:28

Sounds advice all there, Dave.

 

We didn't do the turfing out ourselves - some of the existing audience took that upon themselves. I think next time I will put a more prominent sign on the door saying "£3" entry (or whatever).

 

We do go see a fair few bands, not always as a band, but on 1s or 2s or 3s as well. Paul goes to lots of gigs in Farnham area, and we all went to Said and Done at the Boileroom, some of us go down the local jam nights all that stuff. We are I think gonna get a bit more traction this year as we have a good few gigs lined up. I'll always go to a local band where there's somebody I know in it if I know about it and I can.

dave said:

turfing out the non payers was a bad move, you need to win those people over and turn them around so they want to pay and support the band get them to the gigs where theres no door money , get every member of the band doing the walk around in the breaks meet as many punters as you can and connect with them ,you have to become thier band .the them and us attitude that a lot of bands have is fine for a wedding or function band but the local weekend warriors have to be considered  part of the local tribe.if your not gigging go to see other local bands you must get to meet as many  punters as poss as often as poss.building a good supporting crowd is the hardest and most important thing to acheive, but it must be done.i dont think the few non payers were being nasty ,its more likely they were a bit taken back by being asked for money after already getting in.i dont think it matters if you charge £3 or the full £5

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