Music has lost its importance to the younger generation.
The older I get the better I play. The fact is it takes time to play and instrument with confidence and ability. Its a craft. What I love about music is that I can never stop learning new things. And we all get into that rutt of oh man I sound crap Im playing the same stuff over and over. I've asked other players older than me they feel this too. In todays hi tech world everyone wants things immediately and the value of sustained effort is lost. The fame game is all about appearance. If you look hot in your vid the record will sell. Music doesnt seem to have the same magic and allure it did when I was a teen. Im sure many of you can remember fighting over the family stereo to listen to some vinyl. Image is everything and the music is secondary these days.
There was a kind of ritual to playing vinyl taking it out the sleeve cleaning it be careful not to scratch it. I would stare at the cover throughout the whole album and read every word. Listening to music was done with love and consideration. I know there are DJs now but its all so throw away. I remember how we would boast of the size of our collections of records. When you look at footage of bands from the 60s & 70s they all look so geeky. Maybe they looked hip for their time?? But it wasnt so much the image that was important. It was the music and the message that music delivered.
Im so glad Im not a teenager now. When I was in my teens you belonged,were defined by the music you were into. You were a punk or skinhead or mod or head banger. Now its all about fame and money. I see these so called reality shows where people line up to be manufactured and molded into a marketing ploy. to have a business plan like your own perfume or clothing brand. Where is the soul in that?
There was a kind of ritual to playing vinyl taking it out the sleeve cleaning it be careful not to scratch it. I would stare at the cover throughout the whole album and read every word. Listening to music was done with love and consideration. I know there are DJs now but its all so throw away. I remember how we would boast of the size of our collections of records. When you look at footage of bands from the 60s & 70s they all look so geeky. Maybe they looked hip for their time?? But it wasnt so much the image that was important. It was the music and the message that music delivered.
Im so glad Im not a teenager now. When I was in my teens you belonged,were defined by the music you were into. You were a punk or skinhead or mod or head banger. Now its all about fame and money. I see these so called reality shows where people line up to be manufactured and molded into a marketing ploy. to have a business plan like your own perfume or clothing brand. Where is the soul in that?
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Jake Taylor on -
I agree totally.
All the best
Jake
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Permalink Reply by TripDave on -
I agree with your nostalgia for vinyl records. Yes, the 50's, 60's and early 70's were great eras for the
the development of rock. But, I would have to disagree with you about today's teenagers.
Music has just as much importance to teens now as it was then, and maybe more so.
The "Fame Game" has been going on continuously since Delilah cut Samson's long trusses.
Videos today are history. Without, an expanded cable package, there are no music video
TV shows. MTV and VH1 are Reality show networks now.
In fact, music companies are going to completely drop making videos.
Aside from YouTube and such, kids really rely on the music itself rather than a visual image.
Music has the same allure today for the teens as it did for us, maybe even more. The difference is,
we don't find today's digitally compressed music the kids are listening to interesting.
Rock n Rock cutting edge is a game for youth. We must constantly pass the torch to the next generation.
This is not to say we should abandon rock as musicians but to say, youths buy music made by youth groups, and rightly so.
I play 10 times better now than I did in my 20's, but so what. Ain't no kids beating a path to purchase this old man's CD's.
Nor are they beating a path to buy U2's new CD. That's OK, kids today will have the same complaint we do in 10-15 years.
"In today's hi tech world everyone wants things immediately and the value of sustained effort is lost." This is
exactly what our parents said when we huddled around the record player listening to those scruffy Rolling Stones or mop head Beatles. And let's not forget, 'Disco' happened on our watch.
As a father of an adult boy, 2 teenage daughters and a tween girl, I can say they are just as excited, adamant and passionate about music as I was then. They are also discerning in their listening.
Might I add that a lot of the music coming out today is really good. Not quite my cup of tea but very inventive and melodic.
One advantage to the demise of the music video is an increase in kids desire to see bands live.
Lastly another advantage to the new high tech world is; you don't need an expensive studio and a record contract to produce a CD. Everyone knows at least one friend with a home studio.
So, musicians today actually have more opportunity today than we did.
Perhaps the the irony is not that kids are missing out what we experienced but that we are missing out on what they get to experience today.
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Permalink Reply by Martin Ashworth on -
'Disco' happened on our watch... I didnt like it at the time till I got into Nyal Rodgers. I take your point to a point. There are tv networks now showing nothing but music videos. Perhaps it is just nostalgia, begging our parents to let us watch top of the pops just so we could slag off everyone who was on it lol. I agree there is more access to different types of music today. But I've heard people are starting bands using guitar hero now. Can that be true? I suppose they said the same about drum machines too and sythns. But the 'Fame Game' has changed considerably since Samson and Delila. Its mostly about entertainment, seeing some poor bugger who is clearly retarted works in a warehouse and has been convinced by his work mates he has a gift isnt in my view entertainment. People want the fame today and they dont seem to care how they get it. Im sure there is kids out there with principles who have something to say. As for the latest offering by U2 is anyone buying it?
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Permalink Reply by Martin Ashworth on
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Cheers Jake!
Jake Taylor said:I agree totally.
All the best
Jake
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Permalink Reply by Dolores on -
lol.
I remember walking down the high street, in velvet loon pants and a carpet coat, with DARK SIDE OF THE MOON under my arm ;) hehe.
Young people today are not as excited about gigs and records as they were in our day...the reason? Music is accessable 24/7 and therefore kids just take it for granted.
If they can't make a gig? They just view it on the net. Can't buy the cd? Just download it for free.
They get everything free: music classes, recording gear, instruments...their parents pamper them with computers and iphones.
In our day, you saved up for months and months to go to one gig or buy one album.
It was special. There just isn't that buzz about it anymore.
And we're living in different times too...as you say, it's the fame and the money that's the be all and end all of it now.
shame!
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Permalink Reply by Martin Ashworth on
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Yeah you got it Delores, Darkside of the Moon and Led ZepII got me into playing guitar. I think they call it 'incorporation' in sociology speak. Where we're allowed to rebel to an extent and then it becomes mainstream. Ok so some people will argue that certain genres like gangstar rap are giving a 2 fingered salute to mainstream society. But in my view its just living up to a negative stereotype. When I was in my teens going to the 100 club you would see maybe one or two mohicans in the audience now you see them on Gap adverts! When business takes over the soul dies. Too many people don't see this now. We'd all like a bit of success it depends on how far you want to sell your soul. Its sad to read about Amy Winehouse in the papers. The media tends to concentrate on her addiction problems rather than her musical contributions. Its like they want her to kill herself then we can all feel so sorry. What a talent we have lost. Tradgedy sells too! its the same with the whole Curt Cobain thing. I remember listening to the radio and all these kids were writing in saing how they totally relate to why he killed himself. Ok so maybe Im being insensative. Perhaps its a good thing that there's a forum where people can discuss their problems. Personally I thought what an arse. Music is about being creative and enjoying yourself doing it. If you got something to say its a good way to say it. Yes free instruments free courses is people telling you how to look how to act how to play and what to play. This is how music has become standardised and bland. The my space revolution can be a good and bad thing at the same time. I guess A&R men just trawl thru this instead of going to gigs and catching the atmosphere of a live performance. I dont know do they? At least you have creative control that is at least untill someone takes notice and you will have to adapt to your 'Target Audience. Ok I'll get off my soap box here and go play along to the Lemon Song now. At least I can convince myself I havent totally turned into my dad yet lol.'
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Permalink Reply by Olly Hibble on -
Absolutely, when I first started playing the bass I had to scrape and save for my first bass and amp, they cost together about £100! Since this time i have plied my craft in many different bands, playing some dodgy gigs and running the odd gauntlet or two in less enlightened areas. Maybe we have all been there, cobbling together equipment that has seen more life than Lemmy! But it was live it was a challenge but above all it was and still is FUN! My musical knowledge has grown incredibly and I am still always learning, whether it is in my regular and much loved band fallen Angels or standing in with other bands, its all good to me. Sadly however we were supporting a band in our local area (the venue owner called us up, wanting a support band to stand in as the booked band had pulled out over a disagreement about money!) When we truned up we were amazed to see an array of Marshall heads, speakers and a pearl drum kit in all its glory. The main act must have been about 20 max age! They had the best equipment and looked pretty cool with their dreadlocks and beach bum surf guy look, however the sound was not good, the music mediocre and the severe lack of originality was stunningly obvious. Poor cover versions and weak links. They actually admitted to me after that they would not play for less tha £200 and they actually rated their looks overe their talent! They had little interest in our set and when we were playing seemed moreinterested in their mobile phones and the fruit machine! Fortunately our crowd gave a good accouint of themselves with their usual drunken antics including a relentless onslaught of beer soaked peanuts wending their way towards me a great velocity each time I took to the mic! Combined with a very heart felt attempt at stage diving which was marred by a poorly maiontained table and the commited individuals alcohol erased fact that in your late 30's you are not as agile as you were previoulsy, i.e 20 years ago!!! Top Tip: Dont stage dive to "Sprit of the age" by Hawkwind!!!!
By the ned of the night they were outplayed and outdoen by a bunch a geriatrics! They evebn n made referance to us as "Dad Rock" during their set!
Equally annoying was the fact that their bassist, who seemd intent on using as few strings as possible, and conually staring at his shoes was playing, of all thiungs, a Rickenbacker. When i asked him about ti he said his parents brought it for him as a birthday present (Not that I'm bitter!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)
At the ned of the night the bar owner asked us to come back, forgave us for the broken table! and paid us an extra £40! Which incidentally never made its way past the faithful at the bar! Funny thats where moict of our gig money seems to go these days!
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Permalink Reply by Gray Dourman on -
With teenage and over teenage kids trying to lock me into Guitar Hero, while I dig they are gettin' exposed to some classic tracks they might not have followed because their Dad did, they're still turning themselves into button pushers. Learning the complexities of accomplishment on an instrument requires a commitment of time and effort most kids are unwilling to make. Rap and hip hop and not to mention most current R&B is so formulaic that instant gratification is right there, ie I sound like everyone else, so I must sound good. There's lots of good youth music out there, but it's buried in the fame game. I only say when I look at Billy Fury or early Status Quo I can't really tell my kids there weren't any naff players in my heyday.
You got to keep on doing what you love until you can't do it any more.
Gray Dourman
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Permalink Reply by Trisha Macnair on -
Can't believe your jaded comments - have you guys really talked to any teenagers lately ?? - its no different to how it was when we were teens - just new bands (and the same old ones) and different fashions - and maybe a different thrill from stroking an ipod and gathering info on the web and youtube than cleaning vinyl with a duster and reading the sleeve. My teen and pre-teen kids know exactly what you mean about being defined by the music they love - there are the pink plastic disco girls, the rocked up head bangers, the hippy chicks, the electrofunk... ... just the same. I introduce them to some old stuff and they introduce me to some new stuff and it all goes into the mix. I like some of their stuff and hate some, they like some of mine and despair at some ... And while there is more emphasis on the fame game, they can see through it to find real sounds - there are dozens of bands out there, of all ages, who yong and old appreciate and listen to even though they look like the back end of a bus... Todays teens have the added bonus of endless free access to footage from gigs on youtube (I would have killed for that as a teen - we would wait all week for Old Grey Whistle Test to come round or some other snippet of music footage on the TV). They, and their friends, come to gigs and perform alongisde me at performance workshops, and have even joined in with my band. I wouldn't want to be a teenager and go through all that angst and acne all over again but I'd love to have that many more years ahead of the excitement of good music.
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Permalink Reply by Gray Dourman on
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Trisha,
I agree with some of what you say, but not all...just like you like some contemporary pop music...but not all...I don't really think that's the point that was being made...Making music has lost its 'art'...now every kid with aspirational parents takes lessons...gets them in school...finds music theory and lesson on the net...and so on...during the sixties and seventies when I was deeply involved in the professional music business most of the musicians I knew were either self taught or had only rudimentary music education, those with 'proper' credentials usually went into classical or jazz just like their teachers recommended...now, pop and rock is being manufactured according to a formulae which is impressed on them with a heavier hand than the 2:20 boys of tin pan alley in the '50s. As most of us would probably admit, if it wasn't for the music, and in particular the inventitive 'art' of music, the music business is crap...bad hours, hard on family life, full of vice and deception...yet it is promoted as a viable creative path beyond almost anything else...chances are if you stab someone in South London, they'll give you a keyboard and a computer and tell you to compose a rap about it...let's hear it for the guys who picked up a guitar and stuck their ear to an AM radio before they stabbed someone...
Gray Dourman
www.magichelix.com
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Permalink Reply by Martin Ashworth on
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Trisha Macnair said:Can't believe your jaded comments - have you guys really talked to any teenagers lately ?? - its no different to how it was when we were teens - just new bands (and the same old ones) and different fashions - and maybe a different thrill from stroking an ipod and gathering info on the web and youtube than cleaning vinyl with a duster and reading the sleeve. My teen and pre-teen kids know exactly what you mean about being defined by the music they love - there are the pink plastic disco girls, the rocked up head bangers, the hippy chicks, the electrofunk... ... just the same. I introduce them to some old stuff and they introduce me to some new stuff and it all goes into the mix. I like some of their stuff and hate some, they like some of mine and despair at some ... And while there is more emphasis on the fame game, they can see through it to find real sounds - there are dozens of bands out there, of all ages, who yong and old appreciate and listen to even though they look like the back end of a bus... Todays teens have the added bonus of endless free access to footage from gigs on youtube (I would have killed for that as a teen - we would wait all week for Old Grey Whistle Test to come round or some other snippet of music footage on the TV). They, and their friends, come to gigs and perform alongisde me at performance workshops, and have even joined in with my band. I wouldn't want to be a teenager and go through all that angst and acne all over again but I'd love to have that many more years ahead of the excitement of good music.
Yeah I suppose I was being a bit too general but then again we are bombarded with 24 hour music tv now. Im sure at least I hope there are kids out there who are carrying on and slogging their way around the circuit. Perhaps you missed my point that the whole quest for obtaining a tune offered a little satisfaction as opposed to clicking on a button. But yes i admit I wish I had the resources kids have today back then. But even this has got me into trouble after asking on an official website of Robben Ford what was bootleg and what was available to buy. My intention was to go buy the album i got properly ticked off about how Robben gets really irritated when people thrust unofficial cds under his nose to sign when he didnt know they existed.... Like he needs to remortguage his house? so yes if I wanna here something rare I'll do it by any means. Anyway I digress. Thanx for your comment
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Permalink Reply by Martin Ashworth on
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Gray Dourman said:Trisha,
I agree with some of what you say, but not all...just like you like some contemporary pop music...but not all...I don't really think that's the point that was being made...Making music has lost its 'art'...now every kid with aspirational parents takes lessons...gets them in school...finds music theory and lesson on the net...and so on...during the sixties and seventies when I was deeply involved in the professional music business most of the musicians I knew were either self taught or had only rudimentary music education, those with 'proper' credentials usually went into classical or jazz just like their teachers recommended...now, pop and rock is being manufactured according to a formulae which is impressed on them with a heavier hand than the 2:20 boys of tin pan alley in the '50s. As most of us would probably admit, if it wasn't for the music, and in particular the inventitive 'art' of music, the music business is crap...bad hours, hard on family life, full of vice and deception...yet it is promoted as a viable creative path beyond almost anything else...chances are if you stab someone in South London, they'll give you a keyboard and a computer and tell you to compose a rap about it...let's hear it for the guys who picked up a guitar and stuck their ear to an AM radio before they stabbed someone...
Gray Dourman
www.magichelix.com
Thanx for the tip Im off out with my stanley knife watch this space, I'll dedicate my first album to you. lol
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